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2011-07-07 Joseph Keon PhD Cow's Milk and Human Health: A Critical Look at this Commonly Consumed Food

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KIRK HAMILTON: Hi, my name is Kirk Hamilton, your host of Staying Healthy Today. Our message is simple: To provide you credible usable health information from interviews and our educational resources to help you Be and Stay Well in the busy modern world. Please take a few moments before or after listening to this interview to browse through the Prescription2000.com website, the home of Staying Healthy Today Radio, for our free educational services.
Today's show topic is "Cow's Milk and Human Health. A Critical Look at this Commonly Consumed Food." Our guest today is Dr. Joseph Keon, a nutrition and fitness expert, environmental activist and author of four books, "Whole Health, the Guide to Wellness of Body and Mind," "The Truth About Breast Cancer. A Seven Step Prevention Plan," "Whitewash. The Disturbing Truth About Cow's Milk and Your Health," and his upcoming book "Questions That Matter."

Thanks, Dr. Keon, for coming being on the show today and thank you for writing your outstanding book, "Whitewash. The Disturbing Truth About Cow's Milk and Your Health."

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Thanks very much for having me. I'm glad to be here.

KIRK HAMILTON: So I have to ask you, and you know it's been a journey with me getting my own patients off milk products or at least a trial from since 1983 when I've been practicing. And then I experimented with my own health and realized that I didn't have to have all this bloating and distention. And actually I had hive-like reactions, it's called dermatoglyphics, where you could write on your skin, and it would welt up. And when I got off milk products not only did my bloating and feeling stuffed after meals went away, but that went away as well. So fast forward 30 years and you write this book which is one of the things I'm most challenged with, with patients is to give them evidence, share with them you might want to give a trial off this stuff because it might not be all it's cracked up to be.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: It's really one of the most difficult things I find for people to address when it comes to diet. There's so many areas where people are willing to make adjustments, but when it comes to dairy, particularly cheese, say, it never ceases to amaze how reluctant people are to really consider making this modification.

KIRK HAMILTON: Well it's interesting you brought that up cheese right away. Because I had Neal Barnard on from Physician's Committee for Responsible Medicine, just launched his book, "The 21 Day Kickstart," And we got into talking about food addiction and cheese came up. And about the opioid compounds called casomorphins in cheese in particular. Because I said to him, and I don't know if this is your observation, but if I can keep people off about three weeks of a dairy product that craving goes away. It's almost like clockwork.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Uh, uh.

KIRK HAMILTON: And it's not like a week. It's like three weeks. And he said the same thing. So I'm wondering if you've observed some kind of time line for this craving to go away.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: It's really interesting you say that because I've had that same experience myself particularly with cheese. If you can get people to just hold off for that window time that results in a dramatic change. Those first couple of weeks can be very difficult and I think of it as not unlike watching somebody going through withdrawal, whether it be smoking or addiction to a prescription medication or alcohol or any kind of substance. It's a very, very powerful link.

KIRK HAMILTON: Well you know it's interesting. I didn't know this - I didn't know cheese had the highest amount of casein, I believe, but that's what Dr. Barnard said.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Right.

KIRK HAMILTON: Theoretically, then you would have more of the casomorphins. Are there any other addictive compounds, while we're on the cheese subject, because it's a hot subject that keep you addicted?

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Well it's interesting. We know now that milk, all mammalian milk, has some of these opiate compounds regardless. And the theory is that this is a way to assure that the offspring comes back to the breast, so to speak, and get the nourishment that it needs early in life. If you recall seeing an infant breastfeeding, I think it's always interesting to note that they begin very aggressively suckling the milk, and then they start to let go a little bit, and then you see finally just they let go and their eyes have this glassy look to them and they go off to sleep. And what's going on with this child? Well it could be that this is the effect of the opiates. There are tiny levels of them found in milk. The other compounds, these undigested or not completely broken down proteins that result in a peptide that has the morphine-like effect is something that takes it to a whole another level. Where we see that is in some adults who have the inability to break down the proteins completely. They may have a lack of a certain digestive enzyme or some other deficiency. We know that those are being taken up by opiate receptor sites in the brain. So it's a very interesting relationship. It certainly warrants more research.

KIRK HAMILTON: I have this picture of my grandson just going off to la-la land, you know. But I heard that teleological argument that the reason there's opiates is to have the child come back to the mother's breast. So with that said, let's - when did you get an "aha" that you might want to deal with dairy products at all? Or it started to kind of go off in your brain that this might not be the great American health food?
DR. JOSEPH KEON: Well, you know when I was oh boy just before I turned three I was diagnosed with a serious dairy allergy and I had a number of symptoms. The worst of which was that I had extensive eczema, which was basically a rash in my - in the backs of my legs and inside of my arms. And I remember staying awake late into the night scratching until these areas bled. And my mother consulted with her pediatrician and he said, "Well he'll grow out of it." And she said, "Well I'd like to get off the milk and everything to get him relief." And he said, "Well he won't thrive so you really can't do that. Let me prescribe some ointment, some topicals." So I suffered needlessly for quite a long time because he was one of these physicians who believed that it was essential for me to be essentially suckling from another species in order to grow up healthy and strong. And so that was, you know, an early on experience. Later in my life in my teens I developed horrible acne and I was taking all sorts of medications to try to contend with it. But once I eliminated dairy entirely from my diet the acne went away.

KIRK HAMILTON: Well let's stay with that for a second because acne gets everybody's attention and if someone is listening here that's in their teens they might pay attention. But is it just the milk itself or are there compounds like hormones in milk? For example, if someone said the argument, Well just have raw unpasteurized milk and you won't have to worry about any drugs and things in there." So is it the milk or the compounds in milk, you think?

DR. JOSEPH KEON: It's believed to be the naturally occurring hormones. There are about just under 60 different hormones and growth factors in every glass of milk. And the female hormone progesterone is broken down into androgen hormone, a male hormone, which promotes the production of sebum, this waxy-like substance which can block the pores and when sebum production is excessive you get excessive pore blockage. And then you get the inflammation is what occurs afterwards from the blockage and that sets up the kind of ideal setting for infection and everything that follows that is so dreaded. So there's a lot of good evidence of this. There's been some large studies looking, including data that was derived from the Harvard Nurses Study looking at those who have suffered the most from acne and they pretty consistently tend to be those who consumed the most milk.

KIRK HAMILTON: Now when we're talking about cow's milk, I assume you're - I mean cow's milk products, are you - you're not throwing in there goats and sheep and other livestock like that. You're just talking about cow's milk in particular?

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Right. When I refer to milk in "Whitewash" and associated products, I'm talking about milk from cows and the cheese and yogurt and ice cream made from it. Although obviously people do consume sheep and goat's milk and yogurt made from it for one reason or another. This - most of the research is really focused on the milk derived from cows.

KIRK HAMILTON: So when then did you decide "I'm gonna spend the time to go and write a book about this?" Because I've look at it, it's meticulously done. I know it didn't take a week to do.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: No.

KIRK HAMILTON: And so why did you just really decide to crank up and put all this energy and effort into this?

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Well when I was doing the research for my book, "The Truth About Breast Cancer," I was also doing a lot of public speaking and invariably it seemed women came up and asked me about estrogen replacement therapy or HRT, hormone replacement therapy. Because many were taking it under the belief that it was going to ward off osteoporosis but they also were becoming aware of the potential risk of breast cancer from following those - taking those prescriptions. And so they wanted to know other things about the risks and how they might be able to protect themselves. And I started to do some preliminary research and when I began to discover one thing or another, I just kept asking myself how come I didn't know about this? How come we're not hearing this in school? How come our athletic coaches aren't telling this - us this? How come the federal government isn't providing this information, and so it really snowballed for me, but -

KIRK HAMILTON: Well let me just jump in for a second. How come they didn't tell you what? That milk was bad or -

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Well, you know, any number of things. If you look, Kirk, as an example. We've know if you look at the scientific literature, there've been studies published for 30, 40 years that have shown that as we increase our protein intake we increase the amount of calcium we lose in urine, calcium excretion levels go up. But if you talk to a typical nutritionist or registered dietician today, seldom will you ever hear that in a conversation about protein needs and calcium balance and bone health. So there are a number of things like that that are well established in the literature, in the scientific literature, and yet they don't trickle down and make their way into the daily exchanges with dieticians and nutritionists and of course regular physicians. So for me it was a process of discovery that snowballed and I finally found myself kind of returning to this theme that underlies all of my work which is the concept of informed consent. And only when people have all of the facts can they make truly informed choices about what's right for them.

KIRK HAMILTON: We're talking to Dr. Joseph Keon. He wrote the book "Whitewashed. The Disturbing Truth About Cow's Milk and Your Health." Well let's jump in then. I want to get some of the myths batted around a little bit. One is that if you take calcium in period, or calcium from dairy products, you're gonna have strong bones.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Yes. Biggest myth of all.

KIRK HAMILTON: So tell me why.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Well it's interesting. People are invariably surprised by the fact that when you look at the scientific literature, you look at populations around the world to understand where we have concentrations of bone fracture. Where we see the greatest risk of bone fracture. It is actually in the very populations that consume the most calcium and calcium derived from milk. So it goes against everything we've grown up knowing for certain that if we just drink enough milk, if we just consume enough calcium supplements, our bones will be fine. In fact, the populations that consume moderate to low amounts of calcium seem to be the ones that are most protected.

KIRK HAMILTON: So going from there, how does it have an adverse effect on bone? Are you just saying it's because it's high in protein content and it's causing calcium spill, or is it causing gut problems, or do we know?

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Well there are any number of things. I mean I think the most important thing to establish for people is that contrary to all of the messaging, advertising we've heard all our lives, there isn't a substantial body of evidence that supports the claim that drinking lots of milk maintains bone integrity. And certainly the majority of the evidence indicates it doesn't provide that protection. So then we really must look at what kind of public health risks are there to telling people to continue to consume all these dairy products. And beyond osteoporosis, there's quite a few concerns. There's over 20 studies now, for example, that show a very strong correlation between milk drinking in men and the risk of prostate cancer. In fact, the risk goes up two and-a-half, three times in those who consume the most milk, and this is a substantial problem. One in eight men are being diagnosed with prostate cancer in their life now. So the National Cancer Institute says that the consumption of milk is the most accurate dietary protector for future prostate cancer.

KIRK HAMILTON: Let me interrupt there because I just want to be really clear. So when you say milk, are you including cheese, yogurt, ice cream in that statement, or just fluid milk?

DR. JOSEPH KEON: In a lot of these studies, they - the findings are relegated to milk. They use milk and they don't replicate these findings with you know cheese or yogurt or ice cream or - it's really just focused on milk. So the studies that I cite in "Whitewash" are focused on milk.

KIRK HAMILTON: Well this is interesting, because I just - in my book I reviewed about five dietary patterns over the last 100 years in the United States from USDA graphs. And fluid milk has come down in frequency of consumption since the ‘50s along with eggs.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Indeed.

KIRK HAMILTON: Now cheese has skyrocketed.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Right.

KIRK HAMILTON: And that's one of my graphs. So even though fluid milk is going down per se we're still - it's - in other words those people that just drink fluid milk probably drink cheese - I mean eat cheese and do other things. That's the confusing part for me just because I have those graphs.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: I have a sense of what you're talking about and what's interesting is how milk has changed. I'll give you an example. In this country we have been breeding cows in a manner that favors those that produce the highest levels of IgF1, insulin-like growth factor 1. Well the reason we do that is those cows will produce the highest levels of milk and so they're more profitable. But the problem is when it comes to human beings, we don't want high levels of IgF1, especially as adults. It's highest at the time of puberty, but after that it would naturally be produced at much lower levels. And so the milk that we consume today has higher levels of IgF1, but the addition of the recombinant bovine growth hormone, the genetically engineered growth hormone that's been used to cause cows to even produce more milk, actually stimulate these even higher levels of IgF1. So the milk that we're drinking, we may be drinking less milk than say 20 or 30 years ago, but we're drinking milk that has exaggerated levels of IgF1, it's a cocktail of environmental toxins and other facts that may be playing a role as well. So it's difficult right now to tease it out exactly, what it is that is the element, the catalyst, but we do know this. IgF1 is one of the hottest topics in cancer research today and we know that men and women who have the highest levels of circulating IgF1 have the highest risk of prostate and breast cancer. And that's consistently the case.

KIRK HAMILTON: Let's talk about the other bad diseases that are bankrupting us or going to bankrupt us. That's heart disease, type 2 diabetes, obesity. Those are the major killers in my opinion.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Yeah.

KIRK HAMILTON: So what roles do milk products play in the development of those, if any?

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Well, it's interesting. We know that as one's body weight goes up the likelihood that they're going to develop diabetes, become insulin-resistant, goes up as well. And we obviously have a huge problem with that in this country. And we know that there've been a number of studies done that look contrary again to the messages we've heard, that as milk consumption goes up so does the tendency for one to be overweight. So if we're telling people that they need to consume lots of milk in order to protect their bones and at the same time it's adding fat and excessive calories to the diet, we'd be steering them down the wrong road.

KIRK HAMILTON: Do you have an opinion on, just talking about diabetes for a moment, type 1 diabetes that early introduction to cow's milk may cause an autoimmune type reaction that may damage the islet cells in the pancreas, or do you think that that's not relevant?

DR. JOSEPH KEON: I think that the evidence, although this is something that is hotly debated, I think the evidence is compelling and I think it's something that more research should go into. The suggestion is that this is an autoimmune disease that may come about in susceptible individuals whose immune system attacks their - the islet cells and they can no longer product the insulin. It is interesting when you look at again the incidents of the disease with regard to milk drinking population. I'm of the belief that there may be other triggers and that it's not just isolated to that, but I think it's certainly, there's enough evidence that warrants caution.

KIRK HAMILTON: Let's talk about young children and milk introduction. You know, I mean it even happened to my grandchild. I remember my daughter, who's a nurse and who I had obviously shared my opinion with once or twice (about milk), and the pediatrician recommended going on cow's milk, and in an enlightened area of the world too, San Francisco, so to speak. So I guess my question is, it had to do with getting fatty acids. You know that was the argument.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Right.

KIRK HAMILTON: For the brain. And so tell me your answer.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Well you know, children no more need the milk of a cow than they do the milk of a cat or a rat or an elephant for that matter. Like all mammals, humans have access to their mother's milk and then they're weaned and when other foods become palatable. But no species on earth cross-nurses to another species and continues to do so coursing into adulthood. You know, we are so steeped in this mythology and it is so difficult for people to extricate themselves from it and look at this with common sense. But if you want to look at the essential fatty acids, if you - mother's milk has ten times as much EFAs as cow's milk does. And once children get off the milk, what they should be eating is they should be eating a diet that is rich in plant foods and fruits and vegetables and nuts and seeds and they're going to get all of the essential fats that they need. I think that when people latch onto things like EFAs as an argument for children drinking milk, it's a distraction from the bigger issue which is simply this, that children were intended to drink the milk of their mother, not of another species. And when you introduce a milk that has three times the calcium, three times the sodium, three times the protein, five times the phosphorus, you're inviting all sorts of problems, not to mention 30 different potentially allergenic proteins. So I think children are going to do their best when milk is never introduced into their diet.

KIRK HAMILTON: Well it makes common sense to me. But sometimes, you know, I gotta tell you, I have some patients, probably the ones that get most angry with me, are the people that are most addicted to cheese. I mean literally they look at me like I'm a communist saying you're not American! I mean they're looking at me like you're not American because you're telling me to give a one month trial off milk products! I mean seriously, I've had people really angry with me. And so I deal with it every day. But if I hadn't seen such positive things happen in human beings over 28 years, you know, I wouldn't take the heat. It wouldn't be worth it.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Right. Exactly.

KIRK HAMILTON: So let's - I want to talk about something that's kind of a mystery to me. I hear all kinds of things, but can you run me through the typical life of dairy cow. You know, what it goes through.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: You know, dairy cows, we have this image of course of the dairy cow that is out in the pasture eating green grass and the farmer comes out in the plaid and the overalls and puts his stool down and the bucket and milks the cow. Cows today are subjected to the most unnatural circumstances. They're really treated like a milk pump, as it were, and anything that can be done to maximize the amount of milk that's produced from them and minimize the amount of money that's spent getting that milk is employed. And it sounds harsh and it is harsh and the kinds of things that go on are quite shocking to people when they get a look as happened earlier this year. There were a number of investigative journalism reporters that went to dairies randomly around the country and showed it's a matter of routine that young cows are dehorned through a process called disbudding, they gouge out the horn bud in the skull. It's an extremely painful process that causes elevated levels of stress hormones in the cows. They have their tails chopped off in a process called tail docking to make the application of the milking machines more convenient for workers. They are injected and have additives put in their feed. Antibiotics are a matter of course. They're given prophylactic ally rather than when an animal is sick because we know that when you administer antibiotics, cows grow faster. And that means sooner profits. Most of these cows are constantly kept impregnated through artificial insemination because that's the only way they'll continue to produce the milk.

KIRK HAMILTON: So let me - can I ask a question there because that was one of the parts that I - I've explained but I didn't really understand it. So as soon as the calf is born, does the calf get taken away from the mother and that becomes -

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Calves are taken away usually within 24 to 48 hours, depending on the facility. Some will take them away immediately and this creates a lot of stress. You know these are sentient beings. They're very sensitive. They care obviously about their young and they see them taken away, right away. If that calf is a female she'll join the ranks of the milking cows. If it's a male, it will typically be sold off to a veal farm and raised as veal.

KIRK HAMILTON: As veal. And so that's where a lot of the young - they don't grow up to be big male cows and -

DR. JOSEPH KEON: No, they want them to be isolated and not move because you don't want them to develop tough muscle. They want them to be anemic, iron anemic, and not move and they live a very, very short life of course, in order to be turned into veal. So it's a very stress lifestyle at best. These cows that in a natural setting might live 20 to 25 years, usually are completely exhausted within three to four years max. And then are sold off for processing as meat.

KIRK HAMILTON: Correct. So then after the delivery of the calf, the calf gets removed, the mother's re-impregnated like right away, or is there a -

DR. JOSEPH KEON: As soon as possible. And I don't know the exact timing, but as soon as she can possibly conceive they want her impregnated and producing another offspring. They don't want any breaks in the ability of these animals to continue to produce milk. Some people believe dairy cows just make milk. But they actually, of course, have to be pregnant in order to stimulate that milk production.

KIRK HAMILTON: And it sounds like there's not a lot of outdoor life and movement?

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Most dairy cattle are relegated to concrete stalls and they're moved several times a day into the milking parlor and most of its very automated now. But the idea of dairy cattle being out in green pastures really is a thing of the past for the most part except for in very, very small farms.

KIRK HAMILTON: I'd like to close with two or three more questions, and one of them was what is your opinion of raw unpasteurized milk versus just - you've given the picture of the processed milk. So it there the same problems or less problems or do you'd come up with the same answer?

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Well I realize there's a growing interest in raw milk and there are a number of reasons why people seek it out. I would caution people because you know there is - as real as it is, this problem of pasteurization changing the milk and eliminating digestive enzymes and things like that, flavor, any number of things that people cite as desirable about consuming raw milk. There is the problem, the growing problem of pathogenic bacteria like listeria and salmonella, Campylobacter, that we have to be really careful about. But again, whether it's raw or it's pasteurized, organic or conventionally produced, all cow's milk is a - is delivering to the consumer nearly 60 hormones and growth factors, 30 different potentially allergenic proteins, lactose which 50 million Americans cannot break down properly and suffer when they consume. We've got a lot of environmental contaminants that find their way into milk, perchlorate, dioxin, pesticides, herbicides, antibiotics. Many of these dairy herds are infected with bovine leukemia, bovine AIDS, and another disease called MAP, Myco avium subspecies paratuberculosis. It's a real mouthful, but there's some evidence that this may be one causal factor in Crohn's disease in humans. So again, you know a product not intended for us. There's a lot of elements that place us at risk when we consume it, and one just has to be aware of all these elements when they make that choice.

KIRK HAMILTON: Two last questions. One is, you've talked about obviously the environmental pollutants within, so to speak, the cow.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Yeah.

KIRK HAMILTON: Does just the fact of dairy farming in the mass way we do it wreak havoc on the environment like it does, you know with cattle grazing and cutting down things and all the land?

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Absolutely. We're seeing dairy farms developing now with 7, 8, 10 thousand cows producing. There's an enormous use of land to run these operations. The average cow, dairy cow, consumes about 80 pounds of food a day in the form of grass or hay or corn. Those are huge tracts of land that are required to grow all this food for these animals. In California alone, the dairy herds are consuming 45 million gallons of water every day. And just a glass of milk, an 8 ounce glass of milk, takes 48 gallons of water to produce when you take into consideration all the product and elements. The manure, the urine these animals are producing are in some cases the equivalent of a city of ten thousand people. And in a year in this country 54 billion pounds of manure are produced by dairy cows. We don't have - our land just really reaching, a you know, point where it can't absorb all this so we have nitrates that are being released into streams and rivers, they're choking rivers, leading to algae blooms, and they're getting into the drinking water. We have nitrates getting into the drinking water and people can be made ill and even young children can die when they're exposed. So we don't think about that when we see a carton of milk, but there is a huge toll on the environment.

KIRK HAMILTON: Is it - the last question I have - do you think it's just sheer economics that there's an industry where people are consuming and so someone just produces the product, or are there - I mean the government, let's say - I actually like a lot of what the government has on their websites as far as educational stuff, but because it's where I got a lot of my book from, the USDA websites. But is there some kind of you know support of the dairy industry, or the lobby is so big that these common sense things just get kind of buried?

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Well there are a number of things going on. The USDA has this odd position. They have this dual mandate. On the one hand, their role is to promote American agriculture products. The other hand, there is a vested interest in helping determine what kind of dietary guidelines are established and what kind of information is disseminated to the public. So they really have to divest themselves of one role or the other. I think in the industry you have two things. You have people that see it as a profitable business, a way to make a living. And you also have people that believe that they're providing something that is pure and wholesome and full of goodness and essential to human health. And so they're very proud of the work that they're doing and the product that they're providing. But I think again we have to look at the implications for public health and we have to at least make the information available to people so they can make their own choice.

KIRK HAMILTON: You know I keep having this thought run through my mind as all this dairy is being produced and milk consumption in the United States, at least per capita, is going down. Is it being shipped all over the world? Do we provide for the world or do - the world provide for itself with regards to milk products?

DR. JOSEPH KEON: We do ship out a lot of powdered milk, but there are growing dairy industries all over, in India and in Jamaica and some places you would least think it - you would think it would least be occurring. And even populations in Asia which have historically shunned milk because they have such a high level of lactose intolerance, are trying to find a way to embrace it, are trying to find a way to consume low lactose or reduced lactose products. So while it may be going down here, it is going up in other parts of the world.

KIRK HAMILTON: It's wild. It just makes no sense when you step back and think about it.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: It really doesn't but you know in the end, Kirk, I really think that this is the most successful advertising campaign in history when you really look at it because it goes against the grain. It goes against everything we should instinctively know and it's very, very effective.

KIRK HAMILTON: Yeah. You know the ‘got milk' thing. Well I put on my book, I had a thing called the "Ain't Got Milk Challenge." I did, and then I challenge everybody to go off milk for one month. But you know I could go on for days. You're talking to a believer. I mean, this topic, it's not just because I believe in it. It's because I can go through the science and stuff, but I can just see pictures of patients over 28 years, and from little kids to very large human beings, who have suffered and no one - they've gone to two or three specialists, primary care people, no one has ever asked them what do you eat, are you consuming this? You consuming that? Never, and it's so sad because it's such a simple question. And the therapy is, you know, you take three weeks off and if - the patient will know, you know, and that's what just - I've just have seen horror stories, just from one food. And so that's why it's one of my passions just to give people a trial off (milk products) because I really feel if they go off for three weeks they'll get the message, you know, some how, some way.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Yeah, they will feel so much better. They will feel so much better, it will be difficult to go back.

KIRK HAMILTON: Well I want to thank you Dr. Keon so much for being on the show today. His book is called "Whitewash. The Disturbing Truth About Cow's Milk and Your Health." It should be in everybody's pediatric department, and childhood books and adult books. So I hope you do really well with this book, and thanks so much for being on the show today.

DR. JOSEPH KEON: Thank you very much, Kirk. My pleasure.

KIRK HAMILTON: And I want to thank you, the audience, for listening to this edition of Staying Health Today Radio. And until next time, Stay and Be Well.

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